I've been playing around with different Malediction fits acting as fleet tackle, and this is what I have largely settled on:
3 Rocket Launcher II
Salvager (offline)
Catalyzed Cold-Gas Arcjet Thrusters
Warp Disruptor II
Medium Shield Extender II (actually using a meta module until I get Shield Upgrades IV trained)
Damage Control II
Micro Auxiliary Power Core
Co-Processor II
Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Targeting System Subcontroller I
With perfect skills (which mine are not) this ship has 5518 ehp (albeit with a massive resist hole over EM), does 3994 m/s before overheat, and has peak shield regen of 14 hps.
I enjoy the fact that this interceptor is both fast and solid, and I like flying it in fleet engagements.
However, there have been a number of roams recently where I have been acting as fast tackle for the gang but the target has been very, very fast. What ends up happening is that only Suleiman can actually keep up, so I hold point while Suleiman solos the ship (everyone else is trying to reach the fight).
That works fine when Suleiman is around, but when he's not it's just me and the target, and I either die or have to let them go. So I was thinking about trying to fit a web onto my Malediction as a way of helping the gang catch up. Not something I'd use in most cases because I don't want to get that close. However, being able to actually slow a target when needed could be very handy.
Here's what I'm thinking about:
3 Rocket Launcher II
Salvager (offline)
Catalyzed Cold-Gas Arcjet Thrusters
Warp Disruptor II
Langour Drive Disruptor
Damage Control II
200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plate
Adaptive Nano Plating II
Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Targeting System Subcontroller I
This has 5872 ehp, does 3659 before overheat, and has a negligible shield regen (4hps). However, the resists are very even, with 61% being my lowest resist.
So, does this fit look like an improvement over my current fit? I'm not interested in moving to something with significantly less tank, so I guess what I'm asking is if the addition of a web and 300 ehp is worth the loss of 300 m/s and 10 hps?
An alternative (on the armor tanked Malediction) would be to swap the nano plate for an Overdrive Injector System II, which gives me only 5168 ehp (which I guess is still decent for an interceptor, if a little low for my tastes) but brings my speed up to 4116 before overheat.
3 Rocket Launcher II
Salvager (offline)
Catalyzed Cold-Gas Arcjet Thrusters
Warp Disruptor II
Medium Shield Extender II (actually using a meta module until I get Shield Upgrades IV trained)
Damage Control II
Micro Auxiliary Power Core
Co-Processor II
Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Targeting System Subcontroller I
With perfect skills (which mine are not) this ship has 5518 ehp (albeit with a massive resist hole over EM), does 3994 m/s before overheat, and has peak shield regen of 14 hps.
I enjoy the fact that this interceptor is both fast and solid, and I like flying it in fleet engagements.
However, there have been a number of roams recently where I have been acting as fast tackle for the gang but the target has been very, very fast. What ends up happening is that only Suleiman can actually keep up, so I hold point while Suleiman solos the ship (everyone else is trying to reach the fight).
That works fine when Suleiman is around, but when he's not it's just me and the target, and I either die or have to let them go. So I was thinking about trying to fit a web onto my Malediction as a way of helping the gang catch up. Not something I'd use in most cases because I don't want to get that close. However, being able to actually slow a target when needed could be very handy.
Here's what I'm thinking about:
3 Rocket Launcher II
Salvager (offline)
Catalyzed Cold-Gas Arcjet Thrusters
Warp Disruptor II
Langour Drive Disruptor
Damage Control II
200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plate
Adaptive Nano Plating II
Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Targeting System Subcontroller I
This has 5872 ehp, does 3659 before overheat, and has a negligible shield regen (4hps). However, the resists are very even, with 61% being my lowest resist.
So, does this fit look like an improvement over my current fit? I'm not interested in moving to something with significantly less tank, so I guess what I'm asking is if the addition of a web and 300 ehp is worth the loss of 300 m/s and 10 hps?
An alternative (on the armor tanked Malediction) would be to swap the nano plate for an Overdrive Injector System II, which gives me only 5168 ehp (which I guess is still decent for an interceptor, if a little low for my tastes) but brings my speed up to 4116 before overheat.
***
Since writing the above, I've considered some of the suggested fits that people have shared in the comments to my earlier posts. However, I'm convinced that I NEED a long point (although a scram instead of a web is totally reasonable).
The reason for this is the way that Tuskers fly. The typical gang that I fly point for is a nano/kiting gang that keeps range while focusing on one target at a time. Life is easiest for a nano gang when all your targets are moving at roughly the same speed. If the primary suddenly grinds to a halt because I've hit him with a scram, the gang is faced with two choices: break speed to keep within weapon range (which lets the rest of the gang catch up to them) or switch to a new target (which means the dps up to that point has been wasted). Neither are good options.
On top of that, though, is the general safety and convenience factor; I don't need anything but a long point against most targets, and that keeps me safely out of neut and scram range. The wider orbit also lets me outrun drones and reduce missile damage. All plusses.
So feel free to comment on the above fits, and recommend changes, but do keep in mind that at the end of the day I'm looking for a rock solid interceptor with the ability to catch and slow a nano ship as well as a long point.
If you need to slow a nano ship, you need the long and short points, (both) period. There's nothing you can do about that. Long to keep him from warping, short to slow him.
ReplyDeleteGiven that requirement, only an armor version would suffice. Here's mine:
Highs: 3 x 150 mm II autocannons
Mids: warp disruptor II, warp scrambler II, catalyzed cold gas arcjet
Lows: dcu II, sma II, anp II
Rigs: 2 x ionic field projector I
There is lots of left over PG and CPU, so you COULD add a plate, costing speed, or bigger guns or rockets (I don't use rockets, various reasons like skills). I think a Nos would fit nicely.
Reasoning for rigs: because of commands given to commands executed delay, having the increased locking range helps. Lock a target before in range, point when possible. Plus, the long point can reach out to about 39k.
Plug it in, you should see that same 4100 m/s on heat, DPS would be better (if you had the skills for guns).
As for the repair mod on my ship, I'm finding that it works well. A 200mm plate won't save me against a cruiser or drones anyways, but the repper seems to keep alive and in the fight longer than the plate, plus I can come back repaired. I've actually lost fewer inties since the changes to repair mods from plates. That said, if you absolutely need to stay until your fleet arrives, the plate might enable it, but you're going to die for sure if you stay.
I do think a web would make an OK replacement, but only for faction, like lets say shadow serpentis web. on heat, range = 17km, giving you that piloting buffer while MWD orbiting the target. t2 web = 13km, and that's a hair trigger at 3500+ m/s.
As for the shield fit, the rigs are an issue. You're needlessly chopping raw EHP off in favor of higher resists. While your fit can fit a DCU II, consider that you're adding about 1200 EHP with your rigs and DCU as opposed to an extra 500m/s, and speed is your only real tank.
ReplyDeleteMy approach to the shield fit isn't what you'd call normal, and I daresay many will scoff at the lack of a DCU.
highs: 3 x 125mm autocannon II
mids: MSE II, catalyzed cold gas arcjet, warp disruptor II
lows: 2x sig amp II, 1 nano II
rigs: 1 ancillary current router, 1 polycarbon engine housing
This has no chance of slowing any ship, and is pure buffer, but at least it can (slowly) repair). It's got about 46k lock range though and 4521 m/s unoverheated (assumes all lvl 5 skills). DPS is technically 62 with rf emp, but technically speaking, even 125's don't track at 4km/s or hit at 30+ km, they're solely for clearing drones.
Mine trades raw EHP for that hand wavy EHP. It's up to you, both are good fits. The issue more concerns how you're flying your interceptor. In my mind, the Maeldiciton isn't stong enough to kill anything fast enough (I live in REALLY active delve, so keep that in mind), so I fly it under the premise of "plan to avoid all damage" where yours is saying "plan to take some damage but dish a little out as well." In my area, if an inty catches you, you're dead in the next minute 100% of the time, if not the first 30 seconds.
This is truly one of the things that keeps me so engaged with EVE. While there are (obviously) fits that are objectively worse than similar fits due to being poorly designed, at a certain level it becomes more about a specific fit being better at against some things while giving up a real advantage against other targets. While I don't necessarily have the answer your looking for, I do have a few questions of my own about this. More food for thought than anything really.
ReplyDelete1. I'm curious about how you'd rate the usefulness of the Targeting rig on your first fit. Best case scenario is against a pod, where it makes a 0.4 second difference. Against a Cruiser or above, it makes at most a 0.2 second difference in lock times, while the penalty to shield HP takes off around 150EHP. I've got a fit that's almost identical, but swaps the rig for an Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer to make the EM hole not quite so terrible. (although at 38% it's still pretty bad.)
2. Maybe your gang just isn't right for you. If sometimes Sulei is able to keep up in order to solo ships you've pinned down, why isn't everyone? Just in the same way that a person in a Shield Nano BC would be out of place in an Armor BS gang, maybe you'r either too fast, or they're too slow for your own gang. This is when the FC should simply make the call that even if their tackler (you in this case) can catch something the rest of the gang can't, and you'll just need to pass on trying to kill that Vagabond/Cynabal/Whatever today.
3. Maybe your gang is missing something. Now, I've never flown under the Tusker's flag, but after being on the other end of their guns on several occasions, I think I have a pretty good idea of how you're flying. Everyone out roaming solo and, if you spot something you can't take alone, everyone makes best speed to the neighboring system in whatever they were already flying awaiting the word to jump in. If that's the case, I get that you can't always pick what's showing up with you. Quick story; we used to have a guy in Blood Money that loved flying the Crow. The thing had the EHP of a wet paper bag, but it clocked in at 5km/s, or over 7km/s with heat. He enjoyed soloing frigates from well outside of their engagement envelop in the thing, and if you ever spotted a mission runner he was the perfect person to have put an initial point on them when you're target ended up being 50km off the mission warp-in. The problem was, he had trouble holding onto ships long enough for everyone to get there due to the aforementioned wet paper bag syndrome. This is where another ship complimented him perfectly in the form of some heavy tackle. Although I'm sure there are others, three ships that I fly regularly solo would make for a deadly addition to that sort of pickup gang. The MWD/Web/Scram Vengeance clocking in at 2900m/s with heat, the MWD/Scram Enyo coming in at 3100m/s with heat, and the MWD/Web/Scram Taranis at 5200m/s with heat. The difference between these ships and the Malediction, is that they're not sacrificing their viability as a solo ship just to fit a scram/mwd combo. If no one in the Tuskers is flying ships like this, maybe you could put some encouragement in the right place, or consider trying to take up this role yourself. This is actually what led me away from the Malediction, having someone else who started flying an Interceptor (the Crow pilot) at the same time I did, but his interceptor was faster and just generally better at being an Interceptor than mine was. I ended up fitting my Malediction more often than not with something I "borrowed" from Jaxley with the AB/Web/Scram combo.
Again, apologies for not actually giving you a good answer to your question, but I hope the feedback was at least an interesting read.
I just don't think the fits you're using play to the Malediction's strengths. The Malediction has a rocket bonus and an armour resist bonus. IMO this makes it a natural short range armour tanker, while you're using it as a long range shield tanker.
ReplyDeleteNow I like flying shield tanked long point tacklers, but when I do my preferences are for the Crow or Stiletto: the Crow has the ability to apply its DPS from its full targeting range, while the Stiletto gets a fourth mid slot.
If your really serious about this, maybe you should train Minmatar Frigate V for the Stiletto?
ReplyDeleteMost of the Malediction skills will carry over.
[Malediction, Taur Tackle]
ReplyDeleteSmall Armor Repairer II
Damage Control II
Adaptive Nano Plating II
Warp Disruptor II
Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma S
150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma S
Small Diminishing Power System Drain I
150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma S
Small Ionic Field Projector I
Small Ionic Field Projector I
Only way you'd get rockets on there is by losing the nos I'm afraid. An option, certainly, but the extra cap will help in those situations when you're having to rep to live while killing drones (your only real threat while holding a target), this is also why 150s rather 200s, better drone tracking.
The double ionic rigs rather than targetting resolution is because the malediction already locks fast, especially against the larger ships a gang is generally targetting and there is probably a need to be able to target as far as you can point...
Altho I do echo Naoru's point that the Stiletto might be worth training long term (however, I also understand you already have many rocket skills and a training queue for the next few months that will sit better with Tusker ops. Unless you really want to focus on being an inty pilot)).
@Taurean, I think a SAR would work better than a plate - it should let you fit on a NOS if you fit an ancillary current router and will impact your agility & speed. Also, the lock speed rig is considerably worse than the lock range rig for what we do - we often fly with links and with them you can point up to 50km overheated (with interceptor v). The Malediction has a fairly terrible base lock range and this needs to be boosted considerably to match up. With a lack of free low/mid slots, rigs are your only way of making up the difference.
ReplyDelete@FNG: If you fly with me, you'll see how I'm (almost always) able to run down targets faster than practically everyone else on the field, even if they are in faster ships.
I think you have to decide if your going to hold him and kite while fleet comes or you going to come in tight! I tackled a vagabond and was orbiting at 500 till fleet came. I used scram and web fit cause I was 2 jumps from home.
ReplyDelete[Malediction, tackle small gang]
Damage Control II
Overdrive Injector System II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I
X5 Prototype I Engine Enervator
Rocket Launcher II, Gremlin Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Gremlin Rocket
Rocket Launcher II, Gremlin Rocket
[empty high slot]
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Small Ionic Field Projector I
I'm crap and not experienced, but I was going to suggest crosstraining too. If you know you're going to be fast tackle for a gang, your highs aren't particularly important in my limited limited experience, training in to a better fleet tackling 'ceptor and just focusing on a ship that doesn't need targeting range extension and can fit a MSE, scram, long point and MWD would be the most useful. Your highs are really only good for killing light drones which will some times be travelling >6000ms, so rockets won't hit them anyway. I'm guessing the Stiletto does that, given that's what Nauro suggested? I guess the only thing you would have to watch out for is a dual prop stuff, especially Hookbills, Drams and Cynabals.
ReplyDeleteAlso, try AB-scram-web rocket malediction for solo work! I've never used it but one day(tm) I'd like to, would be interesting to see how you went with it.
What ends up happening is that only Suleiman can actually keep up, so I hold point while Suleiman solos the ship (everyone else is trying to reach the fight).
ReplyDeleteIt's a little scary how accurate that is, actually...
I'd also like to lend my voice to those who have suggested flying the Stiletto. I do understand the annoyance of juggling training plans, however, so it might be best suited as a "someday" ship rather than a "right now" ship. (I still have a fair few of those myself.) If nothing else, though, I think you'd enjoy the contrast between the two.